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	<title>Comments on: Purpose, governance and engagement &#8211; why third sector organisations must face the big questions</title>
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	<link>http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/thersa/purpose-governance-and-engagement-why-third-sector-organisations-must-face-the-big-questions/</link>
	<description>Politics, brains, social action and the day to day life of the RSA’s chief executive</description>
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		<title>By: Indy Johar</title>
		<link>http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/thersa/purpose-governance-and-engagement-why-third-sector-organisations-must-face-the-big-questions/comment-page-1/#comment-1442</link>
		<dc:creator>Indy Johar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 12:55:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/?p=1540#comment-1442</guid>
		<description>Thank you for hosting the event Katherine and your input Matthew.

One of the key issues not made explicit in the conversation the other day was the increasing reality of organisations not using legal form or classic corporate governance models as mechanisms of legitimacy. 

As practice and intervention have become increasingly situational and responsive to context - it is the accountability of action  which is increasingly recongnised as crucial [thanks Mike for opening this debate up here].

Some everyday mechanisms for making practice/intervention accountable have been emerging from the field i.e. the use of the web as a public declaration device which invites cross peer review. These are behaviours that seem to point towards the emerging concept of &#039;open governance&#039;. 

These alternative modes not only appear to liberate agency but also avoid the dislocation of practice and purpose; with a Board of Trustees often too removed from the point of intervention to adequately understand, and support the sensitivities of edge innovation practice.

It might come to pass that the governance of practice may ossify or by osmosis move into the governance of organisation, however a worthy space is opening up currently, in which leadership is no longer about getting permission, but is about the freedom to make something unbelievable happen and the accountability for when something goes wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for hosting the event Katherine and your input Matthew.</p>
<p>One of the key issues not made explicit in the conversation the other day was the increasing reality of organisations not using legal form or classic corporate governance models as mechanisms of legitimacy. </p>
<p>As practice and intervention have become increasingly situational and responsive to context &#8211; it is the accountability of action  which is increasingly recongnised as crucial [thanks Mike for opening this debate up here].</p>
<p>Some everyday mechanisms for making practice/intervention accountable have been emerging from the field i.e. the use of the web as a public declaration device which invites cross peer review. These are behaviours that seem to point towards the emerging concept of &#8216;open governance&#8217;. </p>
<p>These alternative modes not only appear to liberate agency but also avoid the dislocation of practice and purpose; with a Board of Trustees often too removed from the point of intervention to adequately understand, and support the sensitivities of edge innovation practice.</p>
<p>It might come to pass that the governance of practice may ossify or by osmosis move into the governance of organisation, however a worthy space is opening up currently, in which leadership is no longer about getting permission, but is about the freedom to make something unbelievable happen and the accountability for when something goes wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: carl allen</title>
		<link>http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/thersa/purpose-governance-and-engagement-why-third-sector-organisations-must-face-the-big-questions/comment-page-1/#comment-1437</link>
		<dc:creator>carl allen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Apr 2009 08:32:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/?p=1540#comment-1437</guid>
		<description>The manner of loss of the Third Sector Leadership Centre is the latest example of a pattern.
http://www.thirdsector.co.uk/Opinion/Article/892725/Editorial-Umbrella-group-rivalry/

As a number of acerbic wits have said, these big beasts and other big beasts  are responsible for the ghosts of working together, with the spirit of working together being a mere convenience.

Reminds me of politicians and the free market and its cycle of failures  which have little to do with risk taking but a lot to do with selfishness, greed, ego and no one must be bigger than me attitude.

But the really worrisome thing is that the up and coming potential leaders in those organisations take their attitude and cue from those curently in control. So what sort of junk food leaders will the sector have in future?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The manner of loss of the Third Sector Leadership Centre is the latest example of a pattern.<br />
<a href="http://www.thirdsector.co.uk/Opinion/Article/892725/Editorial-Umbrella-group-rivalry/" rel="nofollow">http://www.thirdsector.co.uk/Opinion/Article/892725/Editorial-Umbrella-group-rivalry/</a></p>
<p>As a number of acerbic wits have said, these big beasts and other big beasts  are responsible for the ghosts of working together, with the spirit of working together being a mere convenience.</p>
<p>Reminds me of politicians and the free market and its cycle of failures  which have little to do with risk taking but a lot to do with selfishness, greed, ego and no one must be bigger than me attitude.</p>
<p>But the really worrisome thing is that the up and coming potential leaders in those organisations take their attitude and cue from those curently in control. So what sort of junk food leaders will the sector have in future?</p>
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		<title>By: matthewtaylor</title>
		<link>http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/thersa/purpose-governance-and-engagement-why-third-sector-organisations-must-face-the-big-questions/comment-page-1/#comment-1434</link>
		<dc:creator>matthewtaylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Mar 2009 19:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/?p=1540#comment-1434</guid>
		<description>Hi Carl. I&#039;m not sure I get this. Do you have any examples to illustrate the point?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Carl. I&#8217;m not sure I get this. Do you have any examples to illustrate the point?</p>
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		<title>By: matthewtaylor</title>
		<link>http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/thersa/purpose-governance-and-engagement-why-third-sector-organisations-must-face-the-big-questions/comment-page-1/#comment-1432</link>
		<dc:creator>matthewtaylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Mar 2009 19:15:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/?p=1540#comment-1432</guid>
		<description>Thanks Mike. Big organisations have strengths and weaknesses, bureaucracy being one of the latter. Smaller organisations can be very innovative and close up to the issue but they also find it hard to develop beyond a certain stage. Fortunately, there are now more organisations and sites which aim to give advice about the merits of particular charities and projects, especially in the developing world. But I tend to agree with you that accountability (I prefer engagement ) is generally more important to an organisations&#039; effectiveness than formal governance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Mike. Big organisations have strengths and weaknesses, bureaucracy being one of the latter. Smaller organisations can be very innovative and close up to the issue but they also find it hard to develop beyond a certain stage. Fortunately, there are now more organisations and sites which aim to give advice about the merits of particular charities and projects, especially in the developing world. But I tend to agree with you that accountability (I prefer engagement ) is generally more important to an organisations&#8217; effectiveness than formal governance.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Amos-Simpson</title>
		<link>http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/thersa/purpose-governance-and-engagement-why-third-sector-organisations-must-face-the-big-questions/comment-page-1/#comment-1426</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Amos-Simpson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 22:33:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/?p=1540#comment-1426</guid>
		<description>I think the key thing is accountability and currently accountability tends to lie in the wrong places. It would be interesting to see how different services would be if they were held to account by the people they were supposed to serve, rather than by the few people who make up their governance or by their funders. By that I mean properly held to account, not some sort of exercise in consultation or glossy &#039;look how good we are&#039; stuff.

In this respect I&#039;d argue the style and method of governance are considerably less important than accountability - there are huge charities that have excellent governance, fantasticly expensive legal expertise and yet I&#039;d never donate to them because as far as I&#039;m concerned its my money that is paying for that legal expertise. I want instead to feel my money is making a difference so I&#039;d far rather support a very small, possibly badly structured project that is making a genuine difference in the way that its beneficiaries feel suits them best. What I don&#039;t have from either organisation currently is any indication of whether their beneficiaries actually want the services they provide and find them useful - besides of course the very expensive campaign literature the big organisation produces - which would be funded by your donation ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the key thing is accountability and currently accountability tends to lie in the wrong places. It would be interesting to see how different services would be if they were held to account by the people they were supposed to serve, rather than by the few people who make up their governance or by their funders. By that I mean properly held to account, not some sort of exercise in consultation or glossy &#8216;look how good we are&#8217; stuff.</p>
<p>In this respect I&#8217;d argue the style and method of governance are considerably less important than accountability &#8211; there are huge charities that have excellent governance, fantasticly expensive legal expertise and yet I&#8217;d never donate to them because as far as I&#8217;m concerned its my money that is paying for that legal expertise. I want instead to feel my money is making a difference so I&#8217;d far rather support a very small, possibly badly structured project that is making a genuine difference in the way that its beneficiaries feel suits them best. What I don&#8217;t have from either organisation currently is any indication of whether their beneficiaries actually want the services they provide and find them useful &#8211; besides of course the very expensive campaign literature the big organisation produces &#8211; which would be funded by your donation <img src='http://www.matthewtaylorsblog.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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